This is an UNOFFICIAL link site and message board for english speaking “open” discussions on the New Apostolic Church (NAC). We want this to be a neutral site for all opinions and hope that all participants recognize and respect opposing view points and are above profanity and personal attacks.

Unlike the official site, where everything is in oneness, over here various participants have strong opinions which may not agree with the official NAC party line, be warned. Open discussion means “within the confines of any rules that the Founder and Admins have deemed necessary to promote the stated purpose of this board”.

Thank you

"The members of the New Apostolic Church have zero recourse other than to walk with their feet or their money- many have, more will!

~ Perry ~

Online Bible : NKJV Easy Reference : Bible Passage Lookup / Word Search

Find that word! Dictionary / Thesaurus Want to check your spelling? SpellCheck

Interesting Documents : NACBoard@faithweb

kbb's esnips site : NAC Publications, CAC Historical Documents and more

Official Site : NAC USA/Canada/Mexico NAC S Africa : NACCape NACSEA

NAC International : NAK.org NAC UK & Ireland : NACukie.org NAC Australia : newapostolic.org.au

Administrators' e-mail : Ken :kenlitzke@yahoo.com

Brenda : brenda_lk1@yahoo.com Rich : calamity01@gmail.com

RSS
Email

0 Kudo

Church Dedication

Author	Comment
lost	Church Dedication		Lead	[-]
Posts: 2136 06/30/2008 16:06 High Priestess	Tags : None I am posting this on behalf of someone who wishes to remain anonymous. For Bertie, don't read any further. There was a new church dedication yesterday in NJ. The church was promised to be dedicated on June 29. Ap. Hammer held the dedication, I guess Freund was too busy. However, the church did not receive it's CO (Certificate of Occupancy). All final inspections were not completed, including a fire inspection. There number of people in attendance was around 350. The question is.....is the NAC above the law? Last Edited By: lost 06/30/2008 16:23. Edited 1 time.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
kbb	No and Yes	#1		[-]
Posts: 1573 06/30/2008 16:36 Official Prophet	Lost Please read the 10th article. Clearly the promise of dedication on the 29th by an Apostle trumped any little detail re: Occupancy Permit. Sunday is the day of the Lord, and Divine Services must be held that Children of God may receive the Bread of Life from the Apostle's Altar, this is godly. Regards kbb PS How many congregations closed in order to have this new one, or is the church growing in Jersey ?!? My concept for Detroit would consolidate n=6 into n=1 MEGA-NAC-MODERN-Congregation. Contact me if you'd care to share New Apostolic Church documents/letters/booklets/books. If posted, credit freely given if desired. Originals will be returned if desired, all shipping at my cost.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
deaconess	law-ging on	#2		[-]
Posts: 6727 06/30/2008 16:53 NAC Thorn in the Side	lost asks: The question is.....is the NAC above the law? Apparently Apostle Orlofski -- who is in charge of the National Building Office -- believes the New Apostolic Church is above the law! Apostle Orlofski: is he in the running for the next DA? Last Edited By: deaconess 06/30/2008 17:30. Edited 1 time.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
lost		#3		[-]
Posts: 2136 06/30/2008 16:53 High Priestess	kbb asks....PS How many congregations closed in order to have this new one, or is the church growing in Jersey ?!? My concept for Detroit would consolidate n=6 into n=1 MEGA-NAC-MODERN-Congregation. This is the old Irvington congregation that closed over two years ago due to the location (it was beginning to get rather bad, i.e. car thefts, gunshots putting members in harms way). The congregation has been holding services in a hotel every Wed and Sun since then.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
HelpMFTT	Occupancy	#4		[-]
Posts: 151 06/30/2008 18:42	This is not uncommon for a church to not have CO at dedication. Using residential construction techniques on a commercial use building violates every building code a city may have. The NAC spends all their time skirting these codes (ADA especially) hence the lengthy negotiation for CO. Fortunately for the NAC the inspectors don't work on Sunday, Wednesday nights and weekends when the parking lot is filled with cars.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
hrldpotter		#5		[-]
Posts: 378 06/30/2008 20:55	Lost, could you ask your source if this church is fully ADA accessible?
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
lost	ask and you shall receive.......	#6		[-]
Posts: 2136 06/30/2008 22:07 High Priestess	hrldpotter wrote: Lost, could you ask your source if this church is fully ADA accessible? Yes. There is a handicap bathroom, doors are double wide, and there are handicap parking spaces.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
hrldpotter		#7		[-]
Posts: 378 07/01/2008 08:41	HP has been told that this NAC church is remarkably un-residential from the commercial gas range (why was that needed?) with commercial hood and fire protection to the fire sprinklers throughout the building...
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
Trike Troll		#8		[-]
Posts: 1676 07/01/2008 10:28 Scourge of God	However, the church did not receive it's CO (Certificate of Occupancy). All final inspections were not completed, including a fire inspection. There number of people in attendance was around 350. The question is.....is the NAC above the law? That doesn't surprise me. I've been an eye witness to several such Law skirtings over the last 30 years in the NAC building programs. It seems they continue to live dangerously. I imagine if there were an accident prior to Certificate of Occupancy their insurance renewal rates would reflect that or...the NAC might have to foot the whole bill for a claim. I wonder what their insurer's risk assessment department would say about the NAC walking the razors edge with these habits. It brings to mind a service Kolb Jr held once where he mentioned, Quote: "You know what they call those that walk the razors edge?...criminals." If it fits wear it Google NAC Botschaft...with 1-4-5
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
deaconess	Jim Fendt	#9		[-]
Posts: 6727 07/03/2008 13:06 NAC Thorn in the Side	Was Jim Fendt involved with this project? Also, in a previous post it was mentioned that there were 350 in attendance. What is the approved seating capacity for the building?
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
hrldpotter		#10		[-]
Posts: 378 07/03/2008 14:27	HP attempts to answer deaconesses leading question with the following: HP has waved his magik tape measure and divined the following: Sanctuary ~ 2700 sq ft Overflow 1 ~ 600 sq ft Overflow 2 ~ 1100 sq ft Total ~ 4400 sq ft, generally for assembly, 120 to 150 people per 1000 sq ft, so over 500 people would be HP's best guess
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
lost		#11		[-]
Posts: 2136 07/03/2008 16:50 High Priestess	Good guess HP. It is my understanding that the church has a seating capacity of 500. This number includes extra chairs that can be set up in the aisles. To the best of my knowledge, yes JF was involved, that is why the push to get it done by June 29. That was the date that he promised the church would be ready to the members. Remember, this church was built to hold district services. However, the parking facilities are quite inadequate. The parking lot, again this is what was said to me, has 75 parking stalls. Six or seven of those spaces are handicap. So let's do the math, shall we..........district service attendance, minimum 350 / 70 spaces = 5 to a car.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
Love4Christ		#12		[-]
Posts: 905 07/03/2008 17:38 NAC Reformer	Still - all that being said - it's a pretty nice looking building based on the photos. Yours in Christ, ~ G ~ "There is no wisdom save in truth. Truth is everlasting, but our ideas about truth are changeable. Only a little of the first fruits of wisdom, only a few fragments of the boundless heights, breadths and depths of truth, have I been able to gather." -Martin Luther "The word 'Christianity' is already a misunderstanding -- in reality there has been only one Christian, and he died on the Cross." - *Friedrich Nietzsche*
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
GerGuest001		#13		[-]
Posts: 2514 07/03/2008 17:43	Five people in a Smart?! OK, you can fit at least two Smart cars parked sideways in one parking stall. Wikipedia knows it, too: The idea behind the "Smart car" was to create a vehicle easy to park and short enough to allow "nose-in" parking. Its length of 250 centimetres (98.4 in) would equal the width of a regular parking slot, allowing two or three Smarts to park in the space as one normal car. Sorry, I could not resist. Regards, GerGuest001 Last Edited By: GerGuest001 07/03/2008 17:49. Edited 1 time.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
hrldpotter		#14		[-]
Posts: 378 07/03/2008 19:17	Lost, HP's sources indicate that a paid non-NAC contractor was hired for this project (see HP's recent post in "Hush Puppies". After 15 months of thumb twiddling and pp pulling, JF and his minions had to step in 8 wks before dedication in order to accomplish a modern day miracle. I'm no fan of NAC Contractors in general... But it's my understanding that these guys managed to do what would normally be considered impossible. HP's sources also indicate that though the building was dedicated, it is at least 2 wks from completion. As far as parking spots, etc, these are things that are determined and identified by the Owner, the Architect and the Town Planning Board - shame on all of them for being so shortsighted.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
morse2000		#15		[-]
Posts: 630 07/03/2008 21:01 NAC Inspector	Sounds like this building will have problems like many others built in the NY area - water leaking, things falling apart after a short time. If they rushed it like you say, corners had to be cut and that will start to show up in a fairly short time. And before giving someone credit for fixing the contractor's mess, who is in charge of the district anyway? I would find it hard to believe given his building experience and his personality that he didn't have a big say in the project and who was doing it. Morse
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
lost		#16		[-]
Posts: 2136 07/03/2008 23:00 High Priestess	hrldpotter wrote: Lost, HP's sources indicate that a paid non-NAC contractor was hired for this project (see HP's recent post in "Hush Puppies". After 15 months of thumb twiddling and pp pulling, JF and his minions had to step in 8 wks before dedication in order to accomplish a modern day miracle. I'm no fan of NAC Contractors in general... But it's my understanding that these guys managed to do what would normally be considered impossible. HP's sources also indicate that though the building was dedicated, it is at least 2 wks from completion. As far as parking spots, etc, these are things that are determined and identified by the Owner, the Architect and the Town Planning Board - shame on all of them for being so shortsighted. HP is correct. The church is not completely finished, therefore they couldn't get the CO from the township. JF stepped in because he promised and gave the members his word that the dedication would be on June 29. This congregation has been waiting for over two years, maybe three that they would have a church. Last Edited By: lost 07/04/2008 08:45. Edited 1 time.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
hrldpotter		#17		[-]
Posts: 378 07/04/2008 08:02	morse2000 wrote: And before giving someone credit for fixing the contractor's mess, who is in charge of the district anyway? I would find it hard to believe given his building experience and his personality that he didn't have a big say in the project and who was doing it. Morse Inspector, HP directs you to the possibility that there were two stubborn Oxen, one German and one Polish, the German one had little say in the Construction until the deadline was nearly impossible to reach, HP personally wonders what the Polish one was doing and why problems were not realized all along during the construction schedule and why the German one waited so long to wrest the reigns from the Polish one. <Draw your own conclusion please> The majority of the work was performed by sub-contractors, especially the roofing, siding and windows. While there may be some issues immediately, it's unlikely that this particular structure will suffer from water infiltration - at least not from the roof and siding - flooding is another possibility, but that's an "Act of God" right?
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
morse2000		#18		[-]
Posts: 630 07/04/2008 08:59 NAC Inspector	I seem to recall that at first, this building was promised for last Christmas. It was postponed once, so what was so important about last Sunday that the dedication couldn't be delayed a few weeks until the building was actually ready? It wasn't like the ones holding the dedication were coming from very far away. Then they could also have publicized the dedication and invited the local newspaper and dignataries, which you can't do if you are occupying the bulding illegally. Sounds like ego prevented them from admitting they couldn't meet the date. What is that pesky tenth article of faith again? Morse
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
ChristMySalvation		#19		[-]
Posts: 168 07/05/2008 08:36	Morse- I agree that they could have waited several more weeks and it would not have made a real difference. Dedication was actually postponed 3 times. January, March & May. This was an ego thing, and you hit the nail on the head with one being able to gloat over the other. After 3 broken promises and a new crew taking over, the new date had to be met so that they could accomplish the "miracle". I spoke with a member there and they informed me that much work still has to be done and the "punchlist" is also a long one. PS- no CO, no temporary CO.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post
deaconess	Sand trap	#20		[-]
Posts: 6727 07/05/2008 11:19 NAC Thorn in the Side	I believe Jim Fendt does not understand how important it is for a church to never give the impression that they feel following "rules" set forth by cities can be "overlooked"... or post-poned a bit. The fact that that church officials KNOWINGLY went ahead with the dedication... well... what does that say about my church to the community if they were to discover what took place? If Jim Fendt is not upright in the community... well... what does that say about his scruples in more important spiritual matters? If Apostle Karl Orlofski, who is in charge of the National Building Office, did not do his job and ensure that everything was in its proper place before officially opening the new church for public use... well... what does that say about how seriously HE takes following the law... !!!!!!!!!!! WHY would the church EVER wish to not completely abide by local ordinances... no matter how frivolous they might appear? Shouldn't a church and its agents... above all else... be an example to its community? Fendt is a licensed building contractor... correct? Is he licensed in New Jersey? If so, under what name? Another incident comes to mind: Denver Youth Trip. Kids traveling by train, chaperoned by youth leaders that KNEW they were illegal aliens... that were detained by ICE while traveling... are those kids still under house arrest? Who were their district apostle, apostle, and bishop that approved of them attending? Did I miss the memo? Is Article 10 of our creed no longer in effect? Last Edited By: deaconess 07/05/2008 17:20. Edited 1 time.
My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Invite Blocking Ignore User's Posts Report Post

Quick Reply

This is NOT an official New Apostolic Church website! For official news or
information regarding the church, please contact:

**The New Apostolic Church * 404 Glen Cove Ave, Sea Cliff, NY 11579 * 516-609-9300**

e-mail Peter Johanning, Media Secretary of the New Apostolic Church : peter.johanning@nak.org